Resolved - Sterling Gent Trading sends my deposit to another broker without authorisation....!!!

Well, Official Rep joined the thread
Hello,
We just want to announce that we have joined the thread, we will review the postings above and reply shortly
Regards SGT Team

Lets wait for his reply.
 
Hello,
We would like to introduce ourselves and then reply to BigBird.
We are Sterling Gent Trading Ltd (SGT), a BVI Licensed and regulated broker. We were incorporated in 2006 and became one of the first brokers to get regulated by the FSC in BVI back in 2010. This, like BigBird, is our first post in anywhere in any type of forum.
The crux of what is annoying BigBird is the initial exchange rate he received to enter into a particular trading strategy that traded in USD. BigBird’s GBP funds were converted with the authority of BigBird’s MM by way of an LPOA by the LP where the strategy was traded. That exchange cost BigBird $1,800 and that is what this is all about. BigBird thinks that somehow SGT is responsible for his trading decision to enter in a USD traded strategy.
In fairness, BigBird did inform us that he would go to a forum to seek more experienced people’s viewpoint, with our reply being that of course but to please be sure that the information be accurate. Unfortunately this didn’t happen and we thank FPA for giving us the opportunity to respond to the many inaccuracies in BigBird’s post.
We will begin by saying that we are surprised by some of the language used by BigBird. BigBird calls the BVI “dubious waters”. We are unsure what he means by that exactly but the BVI is an Overseas British Territory with a judicial system based on English law and an excellent pool of professionals. There is a stringent process upheld by the FSC to regulate SGT and we appreciate that process.
Secondly, BigBird seems to be surprised that SGT has an unblemished record. SGT is certainly not surprised. SGT has been in business for 9 years and as the BVI authorities can attest, we have never had an issue. Not one. This is something we are very proud of and work hard to maintain.
SGT has been completely transparent with BigBird. We gave him all the information he asked for during lengthy skype chats and a number email exchanges. The comments regarding placing him in spam with no further replies is simply not true. Each and every one of his emails were replied to. If for some reason his server identified our emails as spam, that is something we did not manage.
1. BigBird and his MM decided on a “handsome looking trading strategy”. At no time did SGT contact BigBird with any solicitation about doing business. Communication regarding the trading strategy was between the BigBird and his MM and at no point prior to the Withdrawal Request being sent to SGT did BigBird communicate with SGT.
2. At no time did BigBird contact SGT to do “some due diligence”.
3. The IB that BigBird was dealing with is not and never has been an employee of SGT.
4. BigBird opened an account with SGT and gave HIS Money Manager Limited Power of Attorney to trade the account. BigBird then deposited GBP with SGT.
5. SGT was advised by the MM that the “handsome trading the strategy” which BigBird selected, was ONLY being traded on liquidity provided through the Currenex technology at a new LP. In order for BigBird’s Trader to trade the strategy, funds were wired to the designated LP. Regarding the comments that the strategy was only available at SGT, again not true. SGT had to open up an account with the new designated LP that offered the strategy. This was an expense to SGT both financially and in time spent on the application, KYC, etc.
6. The MM’s VERY first trade out of the gate, by way of the LPOA, was to convert BigBird’s GBP to USD at the Liquidity Provider so the Trader could trade the strategy. The rate that the Trader got was issued by the LP and had nothing to do with SGT. (We note that another poster in this forum has correctly pointed out that in order for BigBird to trade the selected strategy that HE chose, he would have had to send USD anyway, and that BigBird would likely have received the same rate if not a worse rate from his local bank.)
7. BigBird is confusing the fact that money sent to the LP is money sent to another broker. The LP – which like many other LPs is also a broker. The account held at the LP is held in the name of SGT, not BigBird.
8. The MM, by way of the LPOA, had complete trading control over BigBird’s account. So frankly, BigBird should really be directing all his questions to his MM. SGT was simply the broker who facilitated the trading.
9. We have listened to the recording that BigBird had with the IB and there is no mention by the IB that he is an SGT employee, let alone the right hand man to the owner. We do try to police and work with 3rd parties, such as IB’s and Money Mangers, but it is impossible to monitor or control all outside communications.
10. SGT’s first communication with BigBird was when he contacted our trading desk to enquire about his withdrawal. SGT immediately contacted BigBird, using the telephone number provided and confirmed that he had sent the withdrawal to SGT. SGT then contacted the IB to advise him that the customer wanted to close the account. SGT was told by the IB that they were already discussing the issue with BigBird and asked us to wait 2 business days before processing the wire. As any Broker will tell you, when MMs are involved and performance is poor, there is often interaction between the client/IB/Manager to see if there is an alternative product that can be offered and the account can be salvaged in any way. We simple informed the IB that we had received a withdrawal form from the client and the IB replied that he was dealing directly with BigBird to try and offer another solution.
We have replied to each and every email from BigBird and on one recent occasion he actually thanked us. BigBird’s email: “Thanks for this in depth response. Sorry I haven't returned , Ive been extremely busy, indeed focussing on more positive things.” So, we are unsure why BigBird wants to blame SGT for giving him in depth responses.
Just to make it perfectly clear, as I think there was some confusion, when reading other posts, regarding the return of Big Birds funds. Big Bird has received back his funds, with a full account statement.
For full transparency, there was a delay in funds being returned as outlined above and unfortunately the Bank swift was indeed incorrect causing an extra few days delay. I appreciate Big Birds concern, but we were in regular contact with him throughout this process.
Regards
SGT Team.
 
A very well spoken and honest post in my opinion. My initial stance that BigBird is a typical forex retail trader that really doesn't know the market, is ignorant about most things related to trading and the working of a broker or money manager and should just stay out of forex trading in general.

Maybe I missed it, what is the resounding issue since the money was returned? Is it just the $1800 or whatever from converting? If so, that's a cost of doing business and I would consider this a closed case. Next!

Hello,
We would like to introduce ourselves and then reply to BigBird.
We are Sterling Gent Trading Ltd (SGT), a BVI Licensed and regulated broker. We were incorporated in 2006 and became one of the first brokers to get regulated by the FSC in BVI back in 2010. This, like BigBird, is our first post in anywhere in any type of forum.
The crux of what is annoying BigBird is the initial exchange rate he received to enter into a particular trading strategy that traded in USD. BigBird’s GBP funds were converted with the authority of BigBird’s MM by way of an LPOA by the LP where the strategy was traded. That exchange cost BigBird $1,800 and that is what this is all about. BigBird thinks that somehow SGT is responsible for his trading decision to enter in a USD traded strategy.
In fairness, BigBird did inform us that he would go to a forum to seek more experienced people’s viewpoint, with our reply being that of course but to please be sure that the information be accurate. Unfortunately this didn’t happen and we thank FPA for giving us the opportunity to respond to the many inaccuracies in BigBird’s post.
We will begin by saying that we are surprised by some of the language used by BigBird. BigBird calls the BVI “dubious waters”. We are unsure what he means by that exactly but the BVI is an Overseas British Territory with a judicial system based on English law and an excellent pool of professionals. There is a stringent process upheld by the FSC to regulate SGT and we appreciate that process.
Secondly, BigBird seems to be surprised that SGT has an unblemished record. SGT is certainly not surprised. SGT has been in business for 9 years and as the BVI authorities can attest, we have never had an issue. Not one. This is something we are very proud of and work hard to maintain.
SGT has been completely transparent with BigBird. We gave him all the information he asked for during lengthy skype chats and a number email exchanges. The comments regarding placing him in spam with no further replies is simply not true. Each and every one of his emails were replied to. If for some reason his server identified our emails as spam, that is something we did not manage.
1. BigBird and his MM decided on a “handsome looking trading strategy”. At no time did SGT contact BigBird with any solicitation about doing business. Communication regarding the trading strategy was between the BigBird and his MM and at no point prior to the Withdrawal Request being sent to SGT did BigBird communicate with SGT.
2. At no time did BigBird contact SGT to do “some due diligence”.
3. The IB that BigBird was dealing with is not and never has been an employee of SGT.
4. BigBird opened an account with SGT and gave HIS Money Manager Limited Power of Attorney to trade the account. BigBird then deposited GBP with SGT.
5. SGT was advised by the MM that the “handsome trading the strategy” which BigBird selected, was ONLY being traded on liquidity provided through the Currenex technology at a new LP. In order for BigBird’s Trader to trade the strategy, funds were wired to the designated LP. Regarding the comments that the strategy was only available at SGT, again not true. SGT had to open up an account with the new designated LP that offered the strategy. This was an expense to SGT both financially and in time spent on the application, KYC, etc.
6. The MM’s VERY first trade out of the gate, by way of the LPOA, was to convert BigBird’s GBP to USD at the Liquidity Provider so the Trader could trade the strategy. The rate that the Trader got was issued by the LP and had nothing to do with SGT. (We note that another poster in this forum has correctly pointed out that in order for BigBird to trade the selected strategy that HE chose, he would have had to send USD anyway, and that BigBird would likely have received the same rate if not a worse rate from his local bank.)
7. BigBird is confusing the fact that money sent to the LP is money sent to another broker. The LP – which like many other LPs is also a broker. The account held at the LP is held in the name of SGT, not BigBird.
8. The MM, by way of the LPOA, had complete trading control over BigBird’s account. So frankly, BigBird should really be directing all his questions to his MM. SGT was simply the broker who facilitated the trading.
9. We have listened to the recording that BigBird had with the IB and there is no mention by the IB that he is an SGT employee, let alone the right hand man to the owner. We do try to police and work with 3rd parties, such as IB’s and Money Mangers, but it is impossible to monitor or control all outside communications.
10. SGT’s first communication with BigBird was when he contacted our trading desk to enquire about his withdrawal. SGT immediately contacted BigBird, using the telephone number provided and confirmed that he had sent the withdrawal to SGT. SGT then contacted the IB to advise him that the customer wanted to close the account. SGT was told by the IB that they were already discussing the issue with BigBird and asked us to wait 2 business days before processing the wire. As any Broker will tell you, when MMs are involved and performance is poor, there is often interaction between the client/IB/Manager to see if there is an alternative product that can be offered and the account can be salvaged in any way. We simple informed the IB that we had received a withdrawal form from the client and the IB replied that he was dealing directly with BigBird to try and offer another solution.
We have replied to each and every email from BigBird and on one recent occasion he actually thanked us. BigBird’s email: “Thanks for this in depth response. Sorry I haven't returned , Ive been extremely busy, indeed focussing on more positive things.” So, we are unsure why BigBird wants to blame SGT for giving him in depth responses.
Just to make it perfectly clear, as I think there was some confusion, when reading other posts, regarding the return of Big Birds funds. Big Bird has received back his funds, with a full account statement.
For full transparency, there was a delay in funds being returned as outlined above and unfortunately the Bank swift was indeed incorrect causing an extra few days delay. I appreciate Big Birds concern, but we were in regular contact with him throughout this process.
Regards
SGT Team.
 
3. The IB that BigBird was dealing with is not and never has been an employee of SGT.

Thank you for your reply.

About the above mentioned point: Is the MM regulated by the BVI? Are you allowing non regulated MM to work with you?

BigBird- please confirm that you got all the money back
 
Thanks for the responses.

Just to clarify SGT has indeed paid the funds back. The only question is should the unauthorised conversion costs, incurred whilst the base currency was exchanged at an entirely different broker (without my knowledge), be paid back too. $1800 is not just 'the cost of doing business' and represents a substantial loss to me. One which could have been avoided if SGT/ MM had informed me of beforehand (indeed the subsequent losses from the trading system itself could have been avoided too because I would never have exchanged the base currency into USD). I see no reason why I should pay for these exchange costs specifically because I was never notified that they would be applied and indeed have a recorded conversation between myself/ the MM and the IB expressly saying that they wouldn't be applied and that the base currency for this trading system could be kept in GBP.

I have no record that an external account was opened with Gallant (the LP where the funds were sent/exchanged) and not even any notification from SGT that one had been set up there. I was also not informed my funds would be transferred there to access the trading system that I was clearly told would be available at SGT (and SGT alone). The SGT LPOA is signed by myself and the MM/ trader.

The appropriate wording of the LPOA is as follows:

''Sterling Gent Trading Ltd is authorised to follow the instructions of the Trading Agent in every respect concerning the Trader’s account with Sterling Gent Trading Ltd, except that said Trading Agent is not authorised to withdraw any money, securities, or other property either in the name of the Trader or otherwise.
The Trader has the right and the responsibility to request from the Trading Agent statements on account status and details regarding the overall management of the account, and the Trading Agent is obligated to provide, upon the Trader’s request, such account information and account statements using reporting features as provided on-line by Sterling Gent Trading Ltd.
The Trading Agent represents that he has all of the applicable required government approvals, licenses, and permits in order to exercise this Limited Power of Attorney. The Trader hereby ratifies and confirms any and all transactions with Sterling Gent Trading Ltd heretofore and hereafter made by the Trading Agent on behalf of or for the account of the Trader.''

The withdrawal of my funds took approximately one month to complete, due to the intervention of the IB (introduced to me by the MM as a key SGT employee), who apparently holds the power to delay withdrawal requests (although NOT being an SGT employee!).

If my funds were in SGT's possession, at all times, why would it take 1 month to process a withdrawal request (IB interference or not)? The funds were clearly withdrawn from SGT thus breaking the LPOA from an unlicenced MM.

I have no wish to waste anyone's time with correcting each others' perceived inaccuracies (the IB/MM have provided enough confusion already) I would really just like to address the key question of whether a broker is responsible for the safe-guarding of trader's funds deposited into their possession and whether they are obliged to notify the trader of the change in their funds base currency. My experience with other brokers suggests that, regardless of the trading strategy/ LPOA that is in place, the broker ALWAYS advises the trader of an option to change their account into another base currency and also ALWAYS advises the trader of the possible costs that would be incurred in the conversion.

I am therefore holding SGT accountable.
 
Thank you for your reply.

About the above mentioned point: Is the MM regulated by the BVI? Are you allowing non regulated MM to work with you?

BigBird- please confirm that you got all the money back

Yoda, do you often give advice and comment on things in which you have no clue? Even the NFA has exceptions and exemptions that allow unregulated money managers to trade funds and that sin the U.S. I would assume, while there is heavy regulation on FX Brokers, not so much on the MM. It's not the brokers job to qualify a money manager for a client. If a client asked that a MM trade funds for them and then signs an LPOA, how is that the Brokers fault?

The whole thing is narrowed down to $1800 that bigbird was charged for conversion. It was communicated by the IB/MM that funds would be changed to USD. Then it's said that the fee wasn't disclosed. That's really the issue which lies solely on the IB/MM to make sure the client understands since the broker has had no communication with the client whatsoever, as stated in previous posts.
 
I am therefore holding SGT accountable.


I still don't understand how SGT is accountable. You were aware that USD had to be used and that GBP were deposited. Therefore, it had to be known there was conversion. The issue is that the fee was not disclosed by the IB/MM for whatever reason. This is not on the Broker and you're holdi them accountable is ignorant, naive and simply wrong.
 
The whole thing is narrowed down to $1800 that bigbird was charged for conversion. It was communicated by the IB/MM that funds would be changed to USD. Then it's said that the fee wasn't disclosed. .

I've repeatedly said that NO notification was communicated to me regarding this conversion , by either SGT (the party
responsible for the safe-keeping of my funds) , the MM or the IB. FX-Truth you seem to have an inside knowledge of this whole story, if you have proof that I was notified, please provide!
 
Yoda, do you often give advice and comment on things in which you have no clue? Even the NFA has exceptions and exemptions that allow unregulated money managers to trade funds and that sin the U.S. I would assume, while there is heavy regulation on FX Brokers, not so much on the MM. It's not the brokers job to qualify a money manager for a client. If a client asked that a MM trade funds for them and then signs an LPOA, how is that the Brokers fault?

The whole thing is narrowed down to $1800 that bigbird was charged for conversion. It was communicated by the IB/MM that funds would be changed to USD. Then it's said that the fee wasn't disclosed. That's really the issue which lies solely on the IB/MM to make sure the client understands since the broker has had no communication with the client whatsoever, as stated in previous posts.

For some reason you pop up from no where and you are very active in this thread ONLY and for some reason you are worshiping everything has to do with this broker.

Can you be honest and reveal your relation with this broker?

Allow me to correct you, without being a regulated MM you can't trade on behalf of a trader. You are one rude arrogant person to decide that I don't have a clue.

About the $1800, why the trader must pay the conversion fees? based on what? there is an IB agreement between the IB and broker and the trader is no side of this agreement and therefore I see this action as very brutal and it is enough for me recommend against trading with this broker.

P.S. it's Master Yoda for you ;)
 
Thanks, now that everyone has had their fair say i will escalate this to trader's court and the BVI regulators.
 
Back
Top