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Dishonorable Discharge: Tsathya

Discussion in 'Scoundrels' started by AsstModerator, Sep 3, 2018.

  1. AsstModerator

    AsstModerator FPA Forums and Reviews Admin

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    Dishonorable Discharge: Tsathya

    Tsathya had been an FPA member since March 2016. He'd had one Traders Court case resolved and had another end in a guilty vote.

    On July 24th, 2018, he opened a case against ICMarkets. Most of the evidence presented was for trades on Non-Forex products. Those included oil and gold. He also complained about changing leverage issues.

    He was told that leverage changes have become common since the SNB-CHF Black Swan Event. He was also told that disputes over specific trades on non-forex pairs did not qualify. I told him disputes over trades on those pairs needed to be taken to ASIC

    He ignored his case thread for over a week. I could have dismissed the case as abandoned for this. I decided to give him a little extra time. , but decided to give him some extra time, since it seemed there might be some trades on forex pairs involved.

    I asked him for specific trades involving forex pairs. He promised evidence and then disappeared again for over a week. This time I gave him a deadline to provide evidence. He then claimed he had already provided it and accused me of favoring ICMarkets.

    After wasting a large amount of time arguing he even threatened to file a case against the FPA if I didn't support his view of justice.

    I explained that he could not expect me to devote 100% of FPA resources just to him. I also told him "If you don't have enough evidence, then taking your case to a vote would be an injustice."

    He provided some screenshots showing a Trade is Disabled message on gold pairs. I explained that there are many possible valid reasons for a Trade is Disabled message. I also told him again that he'd need to take any disputes for gold trades to ASIC.

    He demanded to know why I made him wait 2 weeks and accused me of having an ego problem. I never told him to wait 2 weeks. I told him very early in the conversation that he needed to take any disputed gold trades to ASIC. I think my ego problem is that I thought I could eventually extract enough evidence from him to try to help him.

    By this time Tsathya was emailing ICMarkets and CCing the FPA. He send many of the same things repeatedly. He also began making multiple posts in response to any one reply I made in his Traders Court thread. Most of those were repetitive.

    He also decided that IC Markets not only owed him for unfair trades, but also wanted US$25,000 for compensation for physical and psychological agony.

    I told him he needed to provide specific evidence for issues with forex trades. He kept claiming he'd sent it already. Finally, I demaded trade IDs. He then accused me of committing some unspecified crime against him. He also threatened this...

    i am giving 24 hours time to you ,do needful ow i will file case against you ,then you must give that amount which i asked to ic market 25,0000$ + extra 10,000 $ u have to pay keep in mind ,we have international lawyers my students are all over the world , so be careful before write ok .last warning to you

    I should have banned him on the spot, but curiosity got the better of me. I wanted to know if he really had a problem or not.

    I asked him to specify the Trade IDs, opening and closing prices, and the profit, loss of trades involving only forex pairs. I gave examples of what is and is not a forex pair.

    After more time wasted arguing, he finally gave the info. The charts on oil and gold for other parts of his complaint showed a variety of closes trades at the bottom. He finally specified 2 of those...

    aud usd pair sell o.o3 trade number 6590883 price @ 0.73303 csd 0.73937 loss -25.72

    aus usd 8680097 0.05 aud usd sell price 0.74051 csd 0.73906 profit just 3.72


    He could not understand how his profit trade on 0.05 lots made less than a losing trade on 0.03 lots.

    I decided to ask Pharaoh to show him the math. Pharaoh wrote this...

    "AsstModerator asked me to look into this. Check my post count and the kind of threads I start if you are worried that I'm somehow working for any broker. Even my own brokers (which I don't disclose) are always kept under a magnifying glass to be sure they haven't "accidentally" stolen my money.

    I can clearly see why he was not sure which trades you were talking about. Each screenshot was of a chart on something other than a forex pair and had several trades shown at the bottom. One had a trade highlighted that was not one of the two disputed trades. Had you shared the info in Post #43 when he first asked for specific info on forex pair trades, you would have saved yourself and AsstMod a large amount of time and effort.

    Now, let's do the math and see if the numbers you gave make sense or not:

    Damn. What happened to the FPA pip calculator? Guess I'll have to google around to get the formula.

    https://www.xm.com/forex-calculators/pip-value can show me today's value, but that would introduce an error since prices have changed. What it did show me is the exact formula.

    Pip Value = (One Pip / Exchange Rate) * Lot Size. All examples I see use the closing value for this calculation. We then need to multiply this by pips to get final gain/loss

    Pip Value = (One Pip / Exchange Rate) * Lot Size

    I'm going to do this step by step. That way it will be easy to spot if I make an error. It will also make it very plain if the predicted numbers are more that a few cents from the profit/loss shown in your statement.

    Trade ID 6590883
    Open Close Pips Volume P/L
    0.73303 0.73937 -63.4 0.03 -$25.72

    Trade ID 8680097
    Open Close Pips Volume P/L
    0.74051 0.73996 5.5 -0.05 $3.72

    I subtracted to get the pips movement. All other numbers are the ones you provided.

    First, let's check the pip values for the same size of trade. They will be close, but not exactly the same due to prices between the USD and AUD being different.

    Trade ID 6590883
    1 / 0.73937 (price is in USD and your account is in AUD - gives the value of 1 pip) = 1.3519

    Trade ID 8680097
    1 / 0.73996 = 1.3514

    Oh good. They are very close. I would have been deeply embarrassed if I was wrong about that. :D

    Now to check and how much a 1 pip move is worth for the lot size you are using (the Pip Value of each trade). The sizes are 0.03 and 0.05, but need to be adjusted to .3 and .5 to make the numbers work (depends on base lot size and also on getting the decimal point in the right place for dollars instead of cents).

    Trade ID 6590883
    1.3519 * .3 = 0.40557

    Trade ID 8680097
    1.3514 * .5 = 0.6767

    Finally, for each trade, we need to multiply this pip value by the number of pips in the move.

    Trade ID 6590883
    0.40557 * -63.4 pips = -$25.71. You said 25.72, but I had rounded off earlier, so this matches.

    Trade ID 8680097
    0.6767 * 5.5 pips = $3.72

    These are the numbers you reported above, plus or minus a cent. Do you see any calculation errors or anything else wrong here?
    "

    Tsathya still could not understand. He replied "i am so sorry i am unable to understand , how ever when loss comes very high as well as when profit come very law thats what we understand ,can you explain very clear why this ,then whats the trading tool help us if it favour to brokers ,
    anyhow plz expaln in better way this cannot understand
    " and "i caanot understand by we love your calculation and very good manner response ,i have a faith in FPA than early they will really do needful to get back my full money" and then attempted to calculate some pip values incorrectly.

    Pharaoh replied...

    "The calculations are complex, since your account is based in AUD and the pair in question ends in USD. This means you need to convert profit/loss back to AUD based on the closing price.

    Let's make the equation as simple as possible. Pretend I made the same trades in a USD based account. To make it even easier, I'll use full lots - which on xxxUSD pairs are always exactly $10 per pip.

    Trade ID 6590883
    Open Close Pips Volume
    0.73303 0.73937 -63.4 3 Lots

    Trade ID 8680097
    Open Close Pips Volume
    0.74051 0.73996 5.5 5 Lots

    Since the trades are on a pair ending in USD, I know that 1 pip on 1 lot = US$10 no matter what the price is. The math is now very simple.

    $10 x lots x pips (positive if gained, negative if lost) = Profit/Loss on the trade

    Trade ID 6590883
    $10 x 3 lots x -63.4 pips = -$1902 (Loss)

    Trade ID 8680097
    $10 x 5 lots x 5.5 pips = $275 (Profit)

    So, even though the bigger trade was in profit, the profits are much smaller since the market only moved 5.5 pips. The profit trade made $50 per pip, but only moved 5.5 pips. The loss trade was losing $30/pip for 63.4 pips.

    If you still can't understand the math, you'll never be able to tell if a broker is stealing from you or not. If so, then you really need to stop all of your live trading activity (check your brokers for inactivity fee policies first - you may need to either close the account or make a very tiny trade every so often to avoid these). Then take a class which covers how to make these calculations and many other basic things that traders should be familiar with before risking money on the market. The good news is that the FPA has a free class which covers this and so much more. Go here and you can start:

    https://www.forexpeacearmy.com/comm...-trading-education-forex-military-school.158/
    "

    Tsathya was not happy. He again made mutiple repetitive posts on points irrelevant to what Pharaoh was addressing. He bragged about having a M.Sc. in math and demanded the FPA solve equations unrelated to forex. He "proved" he has the M.Sc. by attaching a file stating that he'd completed the coursework, but still had to complete a research project. He also claimed "they already gave me to my PhD in numerical solution of stocticastcis differential equation" while providing no evidence and then went on to say this...

    "if you not ask sorry here sure it will go all universites maths socity where we in a member and all my maths professors who talks us and those who teaching right now ,do u wish that
    keep your mouth before write here blady fools raskals nonsences idiots stopid
    am trading ur money and ur knowldge ,since u support injustice and Ic market issue made me to not understand suddent ,this is one evdence that even we are good in maths ,we cant do small things so ,you ask this compensation too from Ic market extra 25,000 $ so now altogether 50,0000$ adtional since we are public figure we have M.Sc degree ,u insult me on public so FPA have to pay another 100,000 $ as compensation ,before write thing man ,dont write as a un educated babaeriont right ,i am in anger i will write ,but u r traredrs court u have to behave ur self well
    "

    Even better, he claimed there was a law which required brokers to offer smaller lot sizes on oil and gas. :)

    I explained that he already admitted he couldn't follow Pharaoh's math. I asked him for 3 things...

    1. To provide a direct link to any law requiring brokers to offer small lot sizes and to quote it.
    2. To provide a screenshot of ICMarkers admitting fault. He had an attachment labelled as this, but it was just a copy of another screenshot showing an explanation of a "Trade is Disabled" message.
    3. To present a list of disputed forex trades with trade ID, opening and closing prices, trade volume, swap, and PL, plus a calculation showing the P/L he thought he deserved.

    Tsathya was unable to quote any specific law. Instead, he just posted several links to consumer protection websites. None of the links had anything to do with forex regulations. For someone claiming such a strong academic background, this was a very poor attempt to cite sources.

    The "admission" of guilt turned out to be a correction repayment for a single trade and a "goodwill gesture" payment. I suspect ICMarkets thought paying him a few hundred dollars was cheaper than trying to answer all of his increasingly bizarre emails.

    Tsathya was unable to provide any calculations showing he was owed even one cent for a trade on a forex pair.

    He continued to insist that fixing one trade was proof that other trades were wrong. In reality, correcting a trade is exactly what any non-scam broker should do. He insisted that a goodwill gesture payment was an admisstion that all trades were incorrect, but could provide no numbers. I explained that I personally knew of one SEC regulated stockbroker which often did goodwill gestures over small things which were really the clients' fault just to avoid client complaints.

    Tsathya's final "proof" was that someone else complained about ICMarkets. I told him that issues are individual. If I group them as all guilty or all innocent, then if ICMarkets fixed one person's issue, that would be proof that they had fixed everyone's issue. I explained that if someone brought a case against ICMarkets, provided evidence on request and in a civilized fashion, then ICMarkets would have to explain the issue or resolve the issue or else face a vote. I dismissed his case and told him that any further abusive posts would result in him being permabanned.

    His response was...

    "blady fool i dont care your non sence activites ,you have to pay me ,you insult me in public all my universites proferse and my traders and brokers will file case agasit you ,we warning you and giving 24 hours time to ask sorry or give me 1000,000 $ as compensation

    you are mental plz go syco doctor ,u might have family problem you sawing here go mental hospital and c a better doctor
    "

    He also tried posting insults against me and links in several threads in Scam Alerts pointing back to his case thread.

    I pointed out something that anyone who had filed 3 Traders Court cases should know. Only a few people can see what is in the Case Preparation folder. I also said...

    "You have repeatedly rudely insulted me in this thread. You also decided to spread your BS to the Scam Alerts folder. I only wish I could hear the laughter of your professors when they hear you explain why you are owed money but can't even calculate how much.

    If any compensation is owed, it is you who owe me for all the time I've wasted trying to get you to give me usable evidence. Either you are not smart enough to do so, or you have none.

    I should go to a mental hospital to see why I felt compelled to waste so much time on someone who can't figure out how much profit or loss his trades should have. I gave you many more chances than you deserved.

    File the complaint with ASIC and give them the same story you gave me. Then watch how fast they ignore you.

    By the way. I warned you that more abusive behavior would result in you being permabanned.

    Goodbye.
    "

    I thought this was the end of him. Instead, he started emailing the FPA..

    "since you dont have right to underestimate my maths skills even we have degree ,you insult me ,in public as well as now ,not view the case ,this is hiding some evedence to all
    if you are really good why did you hiding rascal blady fools ,
    i am giving 24 hours open my case again ,now you pay me 100,000 $ as compensation ,who are you man make me in jail ,is it ur father s house ,why sholud i go jail
    you must pay since you insult me in public ,
    if you fail to open sure this case wll be filed in international adviocates agist your human rights violations .
    send your feed back as soon as possioblie just 24 hours only your time started
    "

    He was told he had until 5 PM on Monday to lift the threat. Instead, he decided to escalate by CCing a human rights organization. He also again claimed to have a Ph.D.

    The forums team pointed out that he kept varying his demand from 100,000 to 1 million and that the FPA had only seen proof of a partially completed MSc.

    He then admitted that he was only working on a PhD and appealed to the human rights organization to force the FPA to take his unsupported case to a vote and also to force the FPA to pay him compensation.

    Tsathya continued to rant in the same fashion and ignored all warnings that these threats would result in him getting a well-deserved place in the Scoundrel's folder.

    Personally, I think Tsathya owes compensation to the FPA and the human rights organization. He's wasting time which both could be using to help people who have real problems instead of imaginary issues.


    Based on...

    1. Demanding and then threatening the FPA in order to get a Traders Court case taken to a vote with no evidence of any specific forex trades being incorrect.
    2. Making a fictitious claim that there are laws regarding minimum trade size.
    3. Childish demands for compensation for anything that didn't go his way.
    4. Lying about holding a PhD.
    5. Attacking those who tried to help him.
    6. Throwing a temper tantrum when he couldn't understand the math and was pointed to lessons.
    7. Wasting large amounts of FPA time and resources.
    8. Wasting the time of an international human rights organization.

    Tsathya is hereby declared to be a Scoundrel.
     
  2. Tim Armstrong

    Tim Armstrong Recruit

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    You are a very patient person! I would have banned him much sooner. However his rantings were good for a laugh.
    Great work!
     
  3. Jasong83

    Jasong83 Recruit

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    FPA you have gone above and beyond with this idiot. Congrats on being so patient. I think this idiot not only needs basic maths education but also needs basic English lessons.
     
  4. Pharaoh

    Pharaoh Colonel

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    For someone claiming to be studying advanced math, he missed a critical point. Knowing how to do one type of complex equation doesn't grant instant understanding of all other equations. If he even passed high school algebra, he could have followed the math I showed him in the first post I made, but only if he set aside his per-conceived notion that the answer HAD to somehow make a larger trade that only moved 5 pips end up with a large result than a smaller trade that moved over 60 pips.

    His inability to accept the reality of the answers prevents him from ever being able to do the math correctly.

    Yo AsstMod! You're the one who loves Heinlein quotes. How about this one:

    Singing_Pig.

    No matter how hard anyone tries, this pig isn't going to learn how to sing.

    He also reminds me of some other people I've had the displeasure of meeting. The type who feel that if they can't get their way on everything, they are somehow entitles to compensation. My guess is that he regularly makes wild threats like this and gets just enough free stuff and discounts because of hallucinations of problems that he really believes he's somehow entitled to be paid for not getting his way on everything.

    I'd give a herd of goats to watch him argue with a traffic cop who is writing the last ticket of the day before going off shift. :D
     
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  5. Norm1957

    Norm1957 Recruit

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    Wow! Unbelievable stuff, you have the patience of a Saint. I usually get fed up with long emails but I just couldn’t stop reading this. I once made a pip error on gold. It hurt, but I didn’t bleat about it. I learnt from it instead. Now I make decent pips on gold.
    I shudder to think how much of your time was taken up on a lost cause like that. I’d call him a name, but he might sue me !!
     
  6. Jasong83

    Jasong83 Recruit

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    I’m terrible at maths but even I understood your explaination and that’s something. You’re a patient man! Thanks for all the work you do and all the admins behind the scene. Also big thanks to Sive - that man has made me $1000’s - no joke!
     
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  7. forexjim

    forexjim Recruit

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    I think the better reaction would be to put a bullet in his head and put him out of EVERYBODY'S misery who EVER comes into contact with him! LOL! At first I was in disbelief, then I was laughing so hard all the way through this idiot's garbage that my day was brightened! YEA FPA, good job!!
     
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  8. keremg

    keremg Recruit

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    Instead of appreciating the job you guys do, this guy goes full berserk...Some people prefer to bite the hand which feeds them. Unbelievable! The vast resources of knowledge and support you guys provide is amazing. Unfortunately that's the way society is sometimes, you don't get to choose only to have the thankful as members. Thank you very much FPA for all you do!
     
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  9. Onyebuchim C. Obike

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    Quite unfortunate for him and I admire FPA's maturity in handling this case
     
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  10. fxFatCat

    fxFatCat Recruit

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    Reminds me of an old saying.
    When arguing with a fool, make sure he is not doing the same thing!

    Your patience and maturity in handling this issue is admirable, my hat to you sir.
     
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